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Subscribe to RSSNEW YORK — Derek Capo was living the high life. He was in his early 20s, an analyst at hedge fund Everest Capital monitoring international equities, and soaking up the weather and nightlife of his hometown of Miami.
But looking ahead, as he'd been trained to do, Capo didn't like what he saw. The housing bust was starting to strangle the Florida economy, the stock market was looking increasingly erratic and he didn't want to pursue a pricey MBA in the middle of an economic crisis.
He also wanted to test his entrepreneurial muscles, by starting his own business, ideally in a locale that felt economically vibrant, with seemingly limitless possibilities. To do that, Capo left the U.S. in 2007.
He now lives in Beijing, having founded Next Step China. The firm offers Chinese-language immersion programs, and arranges opportunities for foreigners to teach, intern or volunteer in China. "I wanted to take the next step in my life and career," says Capo, now 29. "I connected the dots and decided that I should go somewhere different and learn something new, like Mandarin, to challenge myself. I picked China because it was growing so fast."
It's a curious phenomenon that sends Americans abroad to look for work. The U.S. has traditionally skimmed the best minds from around the world in pursuit of the American Dream. Indeed, according to polling firm Gallup, which surveyed people in 135 nations around the world, the U.S. was the top desired destination of those who wanted to relocate permanently to another country.
But with unemployment hovering around 9 percent, the use of food stamps at record highs and the Great Recession continuing to punish the budgets of so many families, the American economy is much less of a magnet. To some young entrepreneurs, economic possibilities seem brighter in places like Brazil, Russia, China or Latin America. Indeed, the State Department now estimates that 6.3 million Americans are studying or working abroad, the highest number on record.
In fact, according to a survey by marketing consultants America Wave, the percentage of Americans aged 25 to 34 actively planning to relocate outside the U.S. has quintupled in just two years, from less than 1 percent to 5.1 percent. "Those numbers have shot through the ceiling," says America Wave founder Bob Adams, who has run nine such surveys over the years. "They're very surprising, and not something I anticipated. They're looking for work because of the sluggish economy, and they've lost confidence that the U.S. is going anywhere."
Younger Americans seem even keener to look abroad, with 40 percent of those 18-24 expressing interest in foreign relocation, which is up from 15 percent two years ago. "There's a feeling among more entrepreneurial Americans that if you really want to get anything done, you have to get out of country and away from the depressing atmosphere," says Adams, who lives in Panama. " There's a sense of lost direction, so more people are looking for locations that offer more hope about the future."
Just ask Matt Landau, who also lives in Panama. The 29-year-old graduated from the University of Richmond in Virginia before moving "in search of work, a better economy, and a more fulfilling lifestyle," he says. While many of his economics-major buddies are trying to avoid Wall Street layoffs, he set up a travel and investment blog and runs a boutique hotel he fixed up in the historic district of Panama City.
But he now knows that moving abroad won't automatically lead to a life of wine and roses. Every country comes with challenges, including barriers of culture, language, bureaucracy, and economic troubles of its own. "Embrace the hurdles, as they're part of the journey," Landau says. "If you don't embrace them, they'll suffocate you."
Indeed, such a major life decision isn't to be taken lightly. It's a daring chess move for your career, but sometimes risky moves can backfire, as well. "That's why you need to create a plan for your period abroad," says Alexandra Levit, a career expert and author of books like New Job, New You. "Know in advance how long you are going to stay, and what you intend to accomplish during that time. Make sure the job you take will allow you to learn transferable skills that are relevant across a variety of roles and industries."
In-demand skills include IT, engineering and teaching. You can search for international jobs at familiar sites like Monster or Craigslist, or increasingly via social media like LinkedIn. There are also countless local job sites, depending on the particular country you're targeting; visit TransitionAbroad to search by region or profession. Every country has its own work-visa requirements, of course, so do your due diligence at the State Department's terrifically thorough website for Americans traveling abroad.
More tips from Levit: Don't underestimate the costs of relocating abroad (including healthcare coverage), which can be substantial. Choose a location where you have some existing contacts and a potential support system, otherwise you could begin to feel isolated and depressed. And continue to cultivate your network back in the States, so that when you do come back home, the transition will be relatively seamless.
Or you might find that you really enjoy your new life abroad, and want to stay. For Matt Landau, it's now been six years, and he still hasn't tired of a lifestyle that includes plentiful surfing and snorkeling. "I don't regret leaving the States one bit," he says. "But when I do get homesick, I just hop on a five-hour flight back to the East Coast. It's like living in California -- except no one knows who Herman Cain is."
Copyright 2011 Thomson Reuters. Click for restrictions.
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This is SAD when Americans leave to get WORK and go ABROAD!!!
The U.S of A is progressively getting DUMBED OUT!!!
Let's keep advocating raising the taxes of the wealthy so then we can complain when they leave.
Just how many jobs, exactly, did the 1% create as a result of the Bush tax cuts? Take your time.
ctviking
I could care less if the "wealthy" leave, but what does that tired rant have to do with the article?
It certainly doesn't help when IT jobs are being outsourced to India because they work for less money.
I couldn't care less makes more sense.
My youngest is graduating this May with a degree in Chemical Engineering. He is fluent in three languages.
He is atheist.
He is not even considering working in the US. The current GOP push to force religion into everything has scared the crap out of him.
He will take his education and go work in some country that is actually as secular as the US claims to be.
Tell him goodbye for me, Pablo.
I will, thanks.
Pablo, unfortunately, this country isn't about anything but the rich and jesus; which is an oxymoron. They truely seem to think that if jesus came down from heaven; he would vote republican and carry a gun!
I have to admit, for the first time in my life I am truly concerned for the future of this country. If the Republican party continues to slide further right, I can see this country as a third world theocracy, unable to compete in the global economy in a generation or two.
Pablo, what do you think about educated atheistic societies coming back like Hitler or Mao? I think we need to emphasize education, but some of today's technologies are straight out of Mengele and the Stasi. I think some of the surveillance technologies and some of the cloning and IVF, etc. are straight out of twentieth century horror stories, and there are a lot of people who could care less if they got rid of their own grandmother if it benefited themselves. That does not mean I want to be Iran, but I will be damned we go back to Hitler and Stalin. I could have a son your age, and I thank my stars I never had children seeing how my nieces and nephews are being raised, and how atomized and selfish the society is now compared to when I was growing up.
Hitler was Christian; specifically, he was Catholic.
@Agg1557 - I thought Hitler was more of a Gnostic. He only professed to be Christian for political reasons.
Hitler wasn't Catholic, he was Hitlerian. And the republicans today are idiots, or more correctly, "Idiotarian."
Pablo123 -- let me be the first to show your son the door; good bye, good luck, and don't come back crying when the economy of the country he is living in collapses.
The smartest are fleeing, but not to worry, they're being replaced with illegals! Just the way the liberals like it.
Oh, I know! Let's just keep cutting education, remain the only developed country without family leave or universal health care, and just expect highly intelligent, highly educated individuals to simply rot here working 60 hours per week so they can have a bunch of crap they can't enjoy and a family they can't see! Yeah! Great frickin' idea!
The 1% steal all the money, they crash the economy and jobs by hoarding, playing schemes with business stealing community money and property, move their operations over seas, and when they finally bring down the entire economy only then will the selfish in this country get it.
[The sheep will stop their denial and see what the real problem is, greed screwing you]
And at that point, they will have made millions of enemies, not just the ones who get it now.
That should make a great public pandemonium and circus.
The young people have been leaving for a while. In the state of Oklahoma, there are entire counties where the average age is 55 years old. The more lockstep, conservative fundamentalist the region--the more quickly they are losing young people. They do not always go abroad, but they sure as heck are going places where they will not be oppressed by the narrow-minded bigots--Texas has Austin, for example. If one tracked the movement of these young people, one would see pretty quickly that they have little to nothing to do with the "red states."
But, yes, they are going abroad--they are not settling down in those countries, but they are starting businesses and staying mobile, just in case the given country starts to have problems. It would be fun to see just how many of them are living abroad illegally, having overstayed their visas . . . but I digress.
The best and the brightest are leaving--and if you are happy to see them go, then you are a ditz. Who is going to pay for your Medicare? Who will work to support your Social Security? Who is going to help other countries move forward and eclipse the US, using the innovation they were taught here in countries that have the workers and training they need to succeed?
Chase the brightest young people off at your peril--it's the first sign of a country starting to lose its "empire" status and the beginning of the slide into irrelevance.
Not too long ago, people from all over the world, especially of European background immigrated to America because America was the land of opportunity. After fleeing their own native countries that imposed upon them high taxes, limited freedom and oppressive regulations, these immigrants prospered in America because of the free market, low taxes and little government intervention.
Today, the situation has reversed. America's high taxes, socialism, burdensome regulations and excessive government intervention in the free market are driving out Americans to foreign land where there is economic opportunity and freedom. The exodus has become so extreme that some have even renounced their US Citizenship.
Why would an American work in USA with an effective tax rate of 40% when he can work abroad and pay an effective tax rate of 10% with no capital gain on interest and dividend. Why attend a local state university paying $15k when a European unversity cost about the same? Why live/work in USA while worrying about his ability to afford medicine when as a European, he can enjoy free medical care?
On a related note, I have a BS in physics and am planning on going for a PhD. When I get the degree, I think that the chances of me going abroad for work are very high. Any country that struggles to accept evolution, which has overwhelming support from the scientific community backed by irrefutable evidence, over creationism clearly isn't ready to be a world leader in science and technology.
Since WWII, more than 50% of the increase in GDP in the US has been from new technologies (think of the internet, GPS's, computers, LCD screens, MRI machines, chemotherapy, etc.). Meanwhile, Republicans want to decrease research and development spending by the billions to reduce the federal deficit.
Perhaps the US will become a leader in science an technology again some day, but until the American people make scientific progress a higher priority than preventing gay couples from marrying, the US will have to settle for much less than it is capable of.
FatCatGets$700Bil You are one confused dude. Did you see where the entrepreneur was headed? China!! I'm not sure China is the place to go if you're trying to avoid big government. The US is as right-wing as any developed nation can get - that's why educated people want to get the hell out!
I left I haven't looked back. China is the place where the money continues to rise. if you love smog, pollution, no rules and a growing RMB value. You know where to go. The food isn't bad here either. Judging from the news I hear in the states, America is slowly dying, it just doesn't know it yet. Other countries are picking the best brains of western education and using it to their advantage. Regardless of how you feel about China, you can't ignore us.
24paws-447478 wrote:
That sounds similar to what bitter people in Europe must have been saying, when others were smartly running out the door for America in the late 1800s / early 1900s.
America isn't going to die any more than Europe did. But one can't deny that there is a ton of opportunity in Asia, (and not just in China), for those with the brains and skills to take advantage of them.
KiloByte1339 wrote:
But if the liberals are leaving, (you did say "the smartest are fleeing"), will they even care if illegals replace them?
Did somebody say Brain Drain?
Spider Spider Spider - what's it like to still be in 1940?
The country has been ruined by our current crop of OLD PEOPLE spending their lives voting to destroy everything that once made this country great so they could get more benefits. Back in 1971 the USA was the Land-of-the-Free; the greatest nation the world had ever seen. Today the USA is the Prison Nation of the world; the worlds largest police state. The youth of today face a future with no Social Security, no medicare, no Pensions and for most no savings. The Social Security enjoyed by today's seniors will shorten the lives of their children.
Thanks a lot OLD PEOPLE
I don't think all folks are necessarily running overseas to get away from the US entirely. Some just want a new and exciting experience. I'm getting ready to graduate from college, for the second time, and am thinking of working overseas for a year or two for a different perspective on life. I've known many to do just that, they say it's very rewarding in m any ways. I suspect many who go over there, eventually return.
I dunno, my parents worked for 40 years and paid very heavily into their social security and pensions. I'd say they earned every bit of money they get. As a matter of fact, most have. I hope no one thinks that about your when your up there and collecting.
China is the place. Been here 3 years now and love it more every day. A recent study shows approximately 5-7 million Americans have left America for other countries. Waving the flag does not put food on the table & re-electing the same clowns to public office does not make the country better. Do what's best for you and your family, not what's best for some clown politician. My wife and 2 young children come first, not some politician. I'm a veteran, paid my dues, so now it's time for me and family & in our life, China is the place for us. No one had to show me the door, I found it on my own and haven't looked back and no regrets.
The 1%, my guess is they have created more jobs than the 47% who pay no taxes. Time to face facts - just as in Atlas Shrugged - the wealth creators leave - and guess what is left... chaos
One look at the current Republican party and the brain drain becomes frighteningly evident.
Republicans are turning the United States into a greedy, self-serving corporate Plutarchy.
Except the "wealth creators" are the middle class consumers. The 1% just take advantage by providing goods and services to satisfy that demand. Demand creates jobs AND wealth, not the other way around.
If Congress would put holds or cut back dramatically on the number of work visas issued to foreigners to come here, then maybe more of those jobs could be filled by Americans. Instead Big Business coerces Congress into keeping those doors open, so the cheaper labor can come in. It's too bad these ignorant foreigners don't realize they're being gotten on the cheap for slave wages. Better they go to another country that pays them more for the skills they went to school for. America is trying to make slaves of its work force.
Oh no! Our top-rated financial talent is leaving the country! Whatever will we do!
This is part of a pattern I've been talking about for years now. The new business model is suck out every last penny from the U.S. and go somewhere else, leaving us for cheap labor. Anyone that trusts the private sector is a fool, and I'm going on the record to say it again.
Yes, tax the hell out of the 1%, so they leave something behind. Then let them leave, change the currency, and set up an exchange court to redeem the worthless dollar with the new currency on a case by case basis. If you made a mint here and left, $.3 on the dollar. If you stayed and worked toward keeping America great: 1:1. Just to keep our debts honest, all foreign debt gets the same 1:1 deal. The only ones that lose are the traitors to the United States. Let them make their fortunes in China the hard way; without a boost from us.
The knife cuts both ways...How you think other countries felt when there citizens migrated to America years ago to better themselves and there situation?
Their, not there. Not to pick nits but you would find more people might take your comments seriously if you would double check before posting. IMHO, of course.
Don't know, ask Mexico.
What I'm getting at is this.... Now that the tables have turned - you have countries that are offering better conditions or can meet the same conditions that the "US of A" is providing. You will get the same affect that happened years ago with majority of the skilled workers and jobs headed abroad.
i.e. the labor force in the country should work longer, harder, and for much less money!!
Sorry, Brain Picker, but I can't resist:
That would be "effect." (And no, I don't know bobbski.)
Unfortunately "Brain Picker" in two posts doesn't seem to have a grasp on spelling.
Please send these folks overseas. We do not want them here.
Spelling is highly overrated, more a show of respect for other readers than anything else.
Exactly. I have ever growing respect for my forefathers and mothers who became fed up with a broken, stagnated society in there 'homelands' and decided to do something about it.
Which brings us to another thought to ponder: Where is the next great move for an (e)migrant - a place for those of like-minded action.
I have my own very thought through notions regarding this subject.
Jimee - spelling is the root of our written language. Those that can't do not communicate to the rest of the world. If we continue to degrade our language, we will soon talk like parrots at best.
The scary part is that we are getting very close to that now.
What are you guys english teachers or what get real!.
Bill from Oregon wrote:
Um, what? That sentence doesn't make any sense. The problem with picking on other people's trivial errors, is that yours will be equally scrutinized. The rest of us knew what the original poster meant.
However, the more cryptic one makes their post by filling it with spelling errors, the more difficult it is to read when most people only skim posts anyway. Of course, it is interesting how the brain works - can you read the next sentence?
A yustd ta a jorma inuvsretyi hswos htat veen fi rdwos rea crlemmbasd uoy nac listl drae htme.
Ever notice how the people who can't spell or put together a coherent sentence are usually the most vocal for making English the official language of the US? You'd think they'd be all the more anxious to speak and write well, but then, their real motivation is bigotry, not fluency.
@flbikerchick: (Hi again - long time no see.) I sort of take exception to that while agreeing at the same time. I'm a HUGE proponent of proper spelling, grammar, writing and speaking. I'm also a very vocal advocate of legislating English as the official language of the U.S. But, I've often said that it's very hypocritical for us to put down foreigners and immigrants who don't speak perfect English when so many Americans can't or won't do so themselves! So, you're right. But, I'd bristle at being painted with the bigotry brush.
If you think foreign visitors to the US don't have English language skills equal to your own, try taking the TOEFL. It's the test of English skills for students to whom English is a foreign language, and is required for those foreign students applying to US universities. I'm pretty sure most US high school graduates couldn't get a passing grade. There are plenty of free sample tests online.
As for spelling, does anyone know a language other than English where the spelling of a word has so little connection to its pronunciation? Take "through" for example. Were the print shops being paid by the letter when Webster made his dictionary?
I left the U.S. some years ago not just for the job opportunities but for the increased standard of living, blondes and the bikini team.
The European countries are all dying. None of the countries replicate their populations, and they will be Muslim in 30 years. I would want marriage and a family, not a lot of casual sex partners, but I guess that is the norm today.
What makes you think he went to Europe?
He probably moved west of I-5!
I left the U.S. for an extended period. I had to return for personal reasons, but intend to leave again.
I lived in a culture that was very different from ours. Strong family and friendship bonds, work to live not live to work, character rather than possessions defining the person, children running free and taught to respect adults.
I will be returning there, or going somewhere else after I visit some other countries. I don't recognize this country anymore and frankly, I don't much like the people. The corruption here, the lack of values I can relate to, the worship of money and possessions to the point that nothing -- not even their own children -- matters more than "getting ahead," the childishness, the hatefulness, the parochialism, the self-indulgence....
It's just not for me anymore.
I'm fortunate in that I work via the Internet, so can work from almost anywhere... like a cafe in Marrakesh. The Gnaoua festival in Essaouira Yes. :)
seriouslynow-4227937 wrote:
Ah yes, same here. I especially enjoyed the time I spent "working" on a beach in south-western, Sri Lanka. I agree with a lot of the other things you had to say, especially the strong family and friendship bonds found in Asia. While I don't think America as a whole is going down, or that everyone has lost their way, you kind of get that distorted impression by reading many of the ignorant posts written in forums such as this one. And that's unfortunate, especially since the rest of the world has access to what is written here as well, and those who have never been here and know better, may likely get that same distorted impression.
The moment I knew I would never return to America to stay:
Sitting in a cafe in a small Moroccan town where many people had never seen an American before. Drinking assir lemon (fresh-squeezed orange juice that is nectar of the gods).
A little girl runs in among the tables. She is about 4 years old. Ab, she keeps saying to every man, Ab-Ab-Ab. She's looking for her father. She stops at my table and stares at me. Then she looks at my drink.
Assir lemon, eyah? I ask her. She nods, big eyes. I order her an orange juice and lift her into a chair and she sips quietly, staring at me the whole time. Just as I'm starting to wonder what I'll do with her when the juice is gone, a man walks up and laughs. She squeals and jumps in his arms. He turns to me and nods, placing his hand over his heart. Shokran bezaaf, he says. (Thank you very much.) Takes his child and goes.
What would have happened if I'd done that in America? Jail for kidnapping, accused of pedophilia, god knows what.
That little girl will think of Americans as a nice lady who gives one orange juice. The little American girl would be traumatized by an hysterical parent, scary men in uniforms, and a gynecological exam.
I am childless and love children. It hurts me that I can't interact with them here. Such a sad and sick society we've become.
I lived in Saudi for 5 years and would have to say I loved the experience. However, when I was about 8 years old and living outside Washington D.C. my mom took me shopping at a big mall and I somehow wandered off. Granted, I was 8, not 4, but still young. Not sure how I ended up in a soda fountain/snack canteen, but I did. A very nice couple - somewhat older - engaged me in a conversation and bought me a sundae. Not quite sure what happened after that, but I know for a fact that I wasn't abducted, raped, killed, etc. and ended up finding and returning home with my mom unscathed. Nay, somewhat better for the experience. My point being that you don't have to leave the U.S. to find good people. You just have to stay away from bad people.
Seriouslynow, you must come from a realy bad place. It's sad that you seem to not have come in contact with good people in The States.
Duval --
That is silly. Of course I know a lot of nice people in the U.S.
But really, your post illustrates my point.
Funny thing is that the best and brightest Chinese are buying homes and businesses as fast as they can in California. They are bringing money with them. Look at who is at the top of most high tech university classes....It is not the white boys from the Red States....It is these Orientals.....Wake up and smell the coffee....Marketing and stock market gamblers are what we are talking here...not medical, not science, not any form of technology....Yea, we produce the best business crooks. So what if they leave.
The "brain drain" will be reversed again after the Media Elite's Annoited One stops occupying the Oval Office. Need a real economic pro-growth President not a spendaholic/taxaholic that we currently have. His "hope and change" (rather ropes and chains) is hope of a job outside the USA and a change of address outside the USA. This will soon start to reverse again back to us in 2013
Amazing isn't it - the GOP rises to more prominence in American politics, and we have trouble retaining talent ... I'm sure it's just a coincidence.
So the GOP gets control of one part of the govt for a few months and its all their fault.... Dems have had House and Senate since 07.... and a Dem named Obama has been "president" for the last three years.....
They are all idiots though... both sides.... The reps cant even agree among themselves.... the dems are stuck on blaming everyone else..... and we have the nerve to criticize Greece and the EU for their situation.....
Kurt's comments Ummm....so people are leaving for China to escape big government? Really dude? Just stop.
Republicans relocating to Beijing to escape communism?
I blame No Child Left Behind and overindulgent parents. The two have combined to create future adults who only care about getting by with the minimum requirements AND never are allowed to fall on their faces and know how to recover from it (because Mom and/or Dad are always there to catch them).
And this is the sad state we have come too...
Thanx a lot to our so-called leaders. You got the country you wanted...Hope you're happy!
I feel sorry for you if your happiness is based on politics.
I get my kicks from making other people miserable. Happy now, Jimee?
The marginal state of our cities isn't helping this. The quality of our infrastructure is not improving and our towns are ugly and based on sprawl. We are delaying improvements and instead taking a delayed maintenenace approach. This is not a welcoming environment for entrepenuers.
When we gave money to the government for the infrastructure improvements they just gave it away to their friends and supporters. No shovel ready job for you.
I had to read this article just to figure out what the heck the headline was trying to say. Sounded more like a brain eating monster from a movie in the entertainment section.
You don't have to be a genius to realize that moving to another country can have advantages. If you can't get a job in the states or health care and you can afford to move it might be worth it. My husband and I have thought about it. My husband hasn't had a job in his chosen profession in over 3 years. There are some other countries where there is a shortage of experienced workers with his skills. If we could afford it we probably would move.
Obama and his super majority is scaring the intelligent people in the US! With half of the country having below average intelligence in the US - by DEFINITION, and two thirds of the country being below average intelligence in the world, Liberal Socialist Democrats rule. Intelligent people cannot operate under the rule of ignorance. When the elected leaders can't tell science from junk science, intelligent people need to find a better place! The Party of Stupidity is creating a Third World Nation - the US!
What about the Right's attack on science? It takes two to tango, after all, and one just needs to google to find some notable GOP leaders who bash science on a daily basis. Don Young and Jimmy Inhofe, just to name a few.
@Wm.Sanders: right-on - but what do you expect from a group of people that get their information from a "news network" (that shall remain nameless but not blameless) who has broadcast "Alien Autopsy" as a documentary, hosted "serious" programs questioning whether US astronauts actually landed on the moon, and provides an open-ended platform for anyone who wants to question climate change - regardless of their lack of credentials or scientific evidence? I could care less about their political views, but when you use a political narrative to adjust facts and data, that's propaganda. That doesn't mean things can't and shouldn't be questioned, but presenting nonsense arguments by disreputable authorities is hardly good process. People don't take the US seriously when they see this sort of behavior.
A few hedge fund managers and economics majors moving abroad to start up non-high-tech service companies hardly constitutes a brain drain. Actually, our economy would be much better off if ALL our hedge fund managers and Wall St. investment bankers moved to China. Let them do to China's economy what they did to ours. And then China will give them what they so richly deserve.
Not to China, but yes.
All traders should leave this country.
LOL
See, I happen to be one and know what would happen to the economy if we all left. You'd get the life you deserve, for sure.
No, but if the one to five percent increase in people working abroad is true then that might constitute a brain drain.
Everyone is quick to blame the financial sector for our economic problems - but what about those individuals who accepted loans and mortgages that they knew they could not pay? Caveat emptor - "Let the buyer beware". We bear some of the responsibility for the mess we are in, too. Democrat/Republican - they are all politicians. None of them have upheld their fiduciary duties to this nation - but we stood by while their failures kept piling up. Bush and Obama were just the latest in a long chain. A nation doesn't fall overnight. Our troubles were decades in the making, folks.
Right. And that includes not just the bankers who made bogus loans, but all of Wall Street. Apparently every trader in the country is related to Bernie Madoff, as if individuals in other fields never did anything wrong. Perhaps we should vilify all teachers because some are pedophiles.
In part because they saw support from the public if necessary, the government decreased leverage by a full 50%, effectively cutting my income in HALF overnight -- at a time when yes, Virginia, there IS inflation and I am already scrambling for retirement. Furthermore, I am self-employed, so I have to cover my own health care, which is lovely when one happens to have a serious health condition, as I do. Anyone care to guess what heart surgery goes for these days if you're paying for it yourself? Did you know hospitals penalize people for paying directly and increase the costs well over what they charge insurance companies for the same surgery?
I'm tired of being vilified. I work HARD. I trained longer than a DOCTOR to learn my profession. I deserve every penny I get and I deserve respect.
Furthermore, I contribute in a BIG way to the economy. I will give just one example:
Suppose you manufacture widgets and sell them mostly to Australia. Australia's economy relies in part on how well China is doing. So what happens to you, American manufacturer, if China hits a hard bump in the road and Australia can't afford to pay the usual $3.50@ for your widgets?
Do you have to lay off half your work force a week before Christmas?
No. Because I provided liquidity in the currency market through my trading, you were able to protect your business through options on the currencies involved in selling your widgets to the Aussies. Consequently, although it's not a great year for profits, no one has to be laid off and not only do all those little kiddies get their Christmas morning, but your workers don't even know anything is wrong.
I could also explain to you how I help farmers to avoid bankruptcy when the market gets glutted and their soybeans are selling for 50 cents a bushel less than it cost to grow them.
The United States of America would crash below 3rd-world status overnight if it weren't for people like me. So get off my back.
dude (or dudette), you really need to think of yourself less as The Savior and more as The Cog in the Machine. I'm sure that you add some value to whatever firm you're working for, but as far as helping the average Joe (or Josephine) or being a 'BIG' contributor to the US economy? please child, get over yourself.
I'd like to see your stats on how many small businesses in the US (9 employees or less), the backbone of our economy, are playing currency options - so who is it you're really helping? re. your self-induced angst over being 'vilified', well are you really being singled out and castigated by your friends, family and peers?
damn, you do need to retire, and soon. maybe then your attitude won't continue to corrupt those few non-self absorbed people left around you.
Dude or dudette? *sigh*
I don't have time or inclination to educate you but, for instance, the definition of a small manufacturing business is 1500 employees or less.
And every farmer of any size "plays" currency options. It would be suicide not to.
Educate yourself, because I'm just hitting the ignore button on you.
lol, whatever. your semantics aside, firms w/ 9 employees or less constitute approximately 80% of employers in the US. but still, none of that deminishes that you are so self-involved as to not see that you're simply a speck in the flotsam like the rest of us. the difference is that while we're doing what we can to live a decent life and help a brother (or sister) out, you're worried about your troublesome vilification and self-worth issues and so surprisingly, letting out a BIG 'sigh' evidencing your apparent lack of the sarcasm uptake gene.
heh, please retire already dudette (yes, I read a couple of your other posts). oh btw, kudos on the lemonade thing, nice gesture
crap, spelling error.... hope that bobbski or Bill from Oregon don't call me out, /cringe. "diminishes'
LOL Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.
What'd ya do that for?
To clarify: I as in traders, not I as an individual. I as an individual only wishes I had enough money to make even a small impact on the economy.
I just thought it was time to speak up because, having been in this business for many years, I know a lot of traders and most are your next-door neighbor, not some hot-shot inside trader who steals people's retirement fund for a living. No one ever points out the ways in which traders provide the markets and liquidity that helps business to thrive in America. Instead, it's the Hollywood version of some slick-willy Type A glorified criminal, or the media telling one side of the Madoff story.
ahhhhh (said the gastroenterologist, having just cast a stone), in your revised context then it is not difficult to agree that you deserve every penny that you work hard for without screwing someone else (or their pension fund) to get it. and that could apply to traders collectively, as long as they don't cop a respect-demanding Messiah complex in the process. sure, equities/futures/currency trading is all fine and respectable, no reason to single you folks out as being responsible for the country's woes any more than attorneys, bankers or ditch diggers (well, maybe the attorneys. heh).
so, you're not ignoring me after all? you sly minx.... you must really love me, oh yeah! I think so (you're blushing now), I'm right, aren't I? but be forewarned, I'm simply an opportunistic speck in the flotsam.
Nah, I never ignore anyone I threaten to ignore. After all, I bothered to answer them in the first place, so they can't be all bad. I only ignore people who aren't worth answering. IM(slef-centered)O, of course.
And I never blush. That would be a tell, and we wild-eyed gamblers avoid the tell.
Besides, I'm old enough to be your granny. I'm sure of it.
oh, but there's so very much more to it than that sudden facial capillary dilation.... the involuntary batting of a lash or two, demure tautness of the lips, legs seemingly incapable of staying still, a distracted digit wandering thru the locks or tiny shifts of the breathing pattern.... all part of the blush. and all very telling to the knowing mind's eye. granny ;)
at any rate, keep those pro bono lemonades flowing to precious 3rd world waifs while you're exploring the far reaches, and you'll be happier than all of the politically overzealous nutters on these forums.
double post, dang
Whatever happened to the 'can-do' American spirit? Swallowed up in endless, undeclared wars against bogeymen in Iraq and Afghanistan, gulag-style airport frisking, devaluation of currency through Congressional stalemate, excessive H-1B and 'diversity' visas given out to unqualified foreigners? Where are the Americans? Living on food stamps, shut out of jobs by foreign competition or foreigners with visas, devoid of safety net, defined benefit pensions and now, at risk, of losing Social Security or Medicare. Soon, it won't be just the twenty-somethings that leave but anyone wanting more freedom and financial security. Then, it won't matter who gets elected President, since the population will be more than 50% foreign-born!
Guys, guys! There are positives to this! Americans taking our ideals and way of life and business acumen and seeding them in places all over the world. Call it global Americanization. Its not necessarily a bad thing, unless you are in the Middle East, where I happened to live for a few years 30 years ago. If I wasnt strapped down by family and a home I cant sell atm, I would consider moving to Australia or New Zealand, tbh. Now who wouldnt think thats a great idea? Come on now, be honest.....
I really don't think that anyone wants OUR business acumen..... lazy.... gimme gimme, I deserve..... whatever.....
They want the bright, ambitious, ready to WORK for their salary... and that is who is leaving. We are left with pot smoking defense workers in Detroit..... the Occu-Toddlers demanding that I give them what I have... or else they will poo in my yard (or whatever their demands and threats are) and gov't employees that you can't fire making more than the average citizen....
I think you are lying!
Paul L.-1923570 Paul? Did you read the article? The entrepreneur left for China!! China, man!! I'm suspecting that big government isn't the issue here.
Mike, it might just be that OUR big government is the issue. China executes their disgraced politicians; we just give them parachute retirements and multimillion dollar contracts on our news networks.
You better check the immigration policies...
Many countries will not let you immigrate unless you have;
1. MONEY and/or outside income...
2. A clean medical and legal history...
3. NO previous illegal drug problems...
4. Many are now requiring proof of medical insurance. BTY - You Media-care stops at the US border...
5. Australia like others, limits immigrants to specific occupations and has age requirements...
6. Almost ALL will not let you work in many occupations and work permits/visa requirements make finding a good paying job very difficult...
Enjoy living as a Expat, that is what I have been doing for the last 7+years. Have there been problems? Sure, but a bad day in many countries are better that a good day in the regulated/taxed POLICE State called the NEW USA...
When entrepreneurial and/or educated people leave America it's bad for America but good for them at the moment and good for the world. It's not wasted talent at least.
I live in California. Who is Herman Cain?
Ask around while in line at the unemployment office... I'm sure there are plenty there that have great jokes about him.....
It would improve if we got rid of the really dumb politicians. The only problem is Americans keep voting for these idiots.
This is great! Now the US companies can outsource to Americans instead of Indian H1b's.
Ok i see the funny here
See what happens in a right-wing society? Those than can leave.
Conservative, by its nature and definition, implies stagnation is the very best result you can expect. Usually, conservative societies wither and fall into insignificance, much like the United States has since the advnet of the Nixon regime, Reagan voodooism, Contarct On America, the nightmare of 43 and the relentless obstructionism of the current crop of anti-American right-wing buffoons occupying Congress.
Didn't the Dems take over the House and Senate in 07? And I kind of remember a guy named Obama being president for the last few years..... isn't their a D in his discription too???? He had total control for his first 2 years.... House, Senate and Presidency.... passed all kinds of regulations.. no budget tho... but all kinds of reform that seems to make business a little unsure how to proceed....
Political Prisoner - took me awhile to do a little research (you might try it sometime) but I will reply to your implication that republicans have ruined the country since Nixon. Since Nixon/Ford Democrats have held the presidency for 15 years, Republicans for 20. Republican control for 57% of the time. Since that time the Democrats have controlled the House for 22 of 35 years. Democrat control 63% of the time. Democrats have controlled the Senate for 19 of the 35. Democrat control 54% of the time. As you can see, democrats have had a greater percentage of control of 2/3 of government in that time frame. So if you truly believe that the country has gone to hell in that time you should try spreading the blame. If you just want to spew anti-conservative vitriol that is untrue and makes no sense, good job.
America's decline began with Nixon - taking us off the gold standard. Reagan accelerated the decline by driving us into debt faster than ever, and Bush finished us off by driving the economy off a cliff. Thanks Republicans.
Failing to blame Democrats for their part in the decline of America is partisan and naive, at best.
GCV, if we stayed on the gold standard the US would have turned into a third world country in a short amount of time. The US has NEVER had enough gold to back our currency. Anyone that researched it would know that. Don't even mention Fort Knox. The amount of gold there would only cover MAYBE one days worth of transactions of everyone in the US. It amazes me how little people know about how the gold standard worked and think it would fix everything.
The voting populace has skewed to the right. Even Democrats have skewed to the right--it makes me laugh that people think that Obama is a dyed-in-the-wool liberal. People, he is middle of the road, and sometimes he is right of center--those in countries where they actually have an active left-wing know this.
It would be fun to take some of the people who think that Obama is a radical socialist commie left winger and have them go live someplace where the country is actually left wing. They would find out very, very quickly just how centrist and center-right (at times) Obama is.
But, yes, the young people are fleeing the fundamentalist, conservative religious zealots--who are coming to dominate our society (even if they don't always dominate our government). Seriously, when people can refuse to allow government money to pay for birth control because it offends their religious sensibilities, but those whose religious sensibilities are against the death penalty get scoffed at and cannot even be heard--this lets you know that the country has skewed radically in one direction.
I don't know what will happen--I hope that the young people will rally together and take back their country, since they are the ones who are going to have to live in it in the future. We tend to have youth movements every so often, and perhaps this one will be one of the better organized ones--if we are lucky.
Im still waiting for beanathome to say something intelligent. Since the South keeps gaining population and the Blue States ( Including CA) are losing or arent gaining population other than from immigration, your statements do not make sense. Of course, you have an agenda that you are really interested in spouting and just using this article as an excuse to spew your bias and silly non-points. Good Luck with that.
This isn't hard to understand. If these people stay, work hard and become successful they will find themselves demonized as greedy and held as a standard for what is wrong with America. Others will then demand that they pay more and more for wasteful government programs.
Perfect summary John..... I just don't remember when Profit, Success and Ambition became something to look down on..... Now they are going over there where they can prosper, pay their taxes and grow their economy......
johnr-ur hard to understand. I work hard and have been more successful 10 years ago than I am today. Free drugs for old people without bartering for a better price and I'm paying the bill. Two wars put on the Bank of China credit card and I'm paying for it. A 7 trillion dollar loan to Wall Street at .001% interest and then bail their sorry asses out so they can dry up all access to credit? Are you saying that the banksters and their corporate lackeys in Congress are "successful" ? Was Enron successful or the War on Drugs and Terror successful? I know you're a 99%'er-but why do defend the 1% that haven't created 1 freaking job since the Bush era tax give away? Why do excuse criminals that have stolen trillions of dollars from our citizens and driven some nations to the brink of catastrophe? Are you myopic? Blind? An enabler? Why is it okay for them to vote their pocketbook at our expense but we can't ask that they pay their fair share? To those that much has been given, much is expected. Isn't that some Old Testament proverb...or doesn't it fit your worship of your slavemaster?
John, you are right. Hard work and success is now demonized by the libs in this country. They believe everything should come from the government.
stork- I do understand your frustration. For the record, I was against the bank bailouts. I thought they should have been allowed to fail. I actually understand the intent of the medicare drug bill but think it should have been paid for with cuts elsewhere. You say not one job has been created since the Bush tax cuts? I would love to see the same "math" applied there that has been applied to Obama saying millions of jobs have been created "or saved" from the stimulus. The war and drugs and terror being successful depends on who you're talking to. Most of your post rails against government programs. I agree with you. Get the government out of our lives.
johnr123-3235782 And so they escape to China to avoid big government?!!! Do you have any clue? Why are conservatives such complete idiots?
Common man,
I know a lot of hard-working and successful liberals. How do you explain that?
Thank you for the insight, John.
Who is John Galt?
What the heck! My grandparents left the old sod in the 19th century and my father came to the US after WW II. To paraphrase, This ain't my grandpa's America! We're all circling the drain and I applaud anyone who wants to start anew! What an adventure for young professionals....go for it! I may join you, if I ever make it to retirement.
These articles are really written to "bait" the shallow of wit. Americans have been going overseas to work and returning for centuries. So, what's new? Now, this author interviews a couple of such people and then leads the shallow of wit to hypothesize that hoards of Americans are going to China to work. I'm left thinking these people must have something to write about that will hold us here to bicker with one another. Geeeeeeeeeeeeeez. If you want to read some good "stuff," pick up a copy of The Economist.
I work with a lot of smart people that came to America from countries like India and China. These are very smart people - educated in school systems that do not cater to the lowest common denominator. They are scientists and engineers. They are much much more competent than the American kids that come and work here. Lately they have all said the same thing. America isn't the place to come anymore. Their friends overseas are not trying to get to the US anymore - their own living standards have risen so much and the opportunities they have at home far outweigh what they could get in America. Personally, I am probably going to be working in China next year. After that, I'm considering a stint in Europe, but my friend is suggesting South America as a place to settle. This is reality. America is not the land of opportunity anymore.
Don't let the door hit you in the behind on the way out. America: love it or LEAVE it. See ya.
I say leave it, to people like you. It's not even America anymore.
Ignorant, obnoxious, childish, and proud of it should be the new motto of the U.S.
"Love it or leave it" Hah! What a stupid motto. Have you ever played the video game Tropico? You play as a dictator in charge of an island. Love it or Leave it is an immigration policy that you can use when all else has failed and you don't want the rebels to take over the island.
GCV---you are one naive man. First of all, applications to US universities from China have risen 500% in the past 4 years. And you will find NO ONE on the Mainland who says that China's education system is sound or better than the US. I can't wait for you to come here to China and see how almost everyone who has not been educated abroad has trouble solving any sort of non-mathematical problem, inductive reasoning, thinking independently, leading, or being creative. I would love to watch the frustrations you will have with this starting your first week. And all those Chinese people who say the US is not the place to go anymore? That is typical propaganda they are feeding you. They are in the USA, obviously, and gaining entrance to the US to live is still the biggest face-gaining move a Mainland Chinese can secure among his peers. You have no idea what you are talking about. I have lived and worked here for many years.
How is it that so many people are so dim? The number of posts I read every day that contain the phrase "Love it or leave it!" is staggering. These people actually think it's a patriotic thing to say, when in reality it's incredibly un-American. People don't agree with you so they should leave the country? Are you freakin' kidding me?!
Oh hell, why bother if they're not going to think for themselves and are just going to spew mindless phrases like a parrot? I guess that trying to teach them that the right to express differing opinions is one of the things that made this country great would be like trying to teach math to a dog. Those people learned everything they'll ever know a long time ago.
The standard of living continues to rise in many other countries while here in the US ours continues to fall.
Its got electrolytes.....
Water!? You mean the stuff in the toilet?
Perhaps the educated young are leaving the US because the citizens care more about party politics than the decline of the US. I'm sick of hearing about the "evilness" of the Republican party by the Democrats and hearing Republicans make ridiculous claims about Obama's background or calling him the "anointed one."
Well, he is...isn't he? Or is it really the "self-annointed one"?
When faith becomes more important than science you know you are in trouble.
whether you wish to argue the issue from the viewpoint that Republican policy encourages business to send jobs overseas, or that Democratic policy overloads business with extra costs/taxes/etc which diminishes hiring, the net result is the same.... fewer well-paying jobs available across America's multi-color collar spectrum.
we Americans are opportunists and one of our greatest strengths has been our adaptability.... so now we're adapting to the new reality that some of the best opportunities, fiscal and social, are available outside of our borders.
unless our country's leadership, and I mean all sides, put their 'America First, Party Second' hats back on the trend will not stop. there's way too many great experiences to be had overseas; combine that w/ reasonable compensation and the only people not tempted to test those waters are those who haven't bothered as yet to pull their heads from damp, dark places.
I left the US more nearly 10 years ago and have few regrets. I earn more than I ever did in the US, I don't have to take my shoes off or get frisked at the airport and I can leave my door unlocked all the time. It is easy to see why people are leaving... tax, lifestyle and opportunity are real draw cards and the US is not very appealing in these regards.
TIDubai Ummm...so, like the entrepreneur in the article, we should go to China to avoid big government. Really?!! I'm going to China to avoid morons like you!! Have you any clue that they US is as far right as any developed country can get?
I never mentioned China. I moved to Dubai but also lived in the former Soviet Union, New Zealand and Europe. The UAE certainly has a smaller government intrusion than the US.
ROFL. Oh gosh, you can't say THAT here!
Didn't you know that is an ARAB country? Full of MUSLIMS?