Stocks are a speculative bubble. This is like Tulip mania, South Sea bubble. Google for "STOCK MARKET KONDRATIEFF WAVE" to understand why. Crash is coming and Great Depression is going to pale compared to it.

What's this?????? The markets have "soared" every time there is a hint the European debt problem is "solved". The only problem is, like the US debt problem, it isn't "solved". And like the US citizens the EU citizens are going to pay a real large price for the bailout of the Greek government and the EU financials.

The economic mess the world is experiencing didn't happen over night and it will not be "solved" over night. We have a long, hard road ahead of us. The soner our pols start making intelligent decisions and start working together for the betterment of this country, the sooner we'll "solve" this mess. Unfortunately I don't feel this wil happen any time soon.

Truth in advertising - The market will be manic depressive until Europe figures out what to do about Portugal, Spain, Greece, Etc. Expect elation followed by dark depression as stockholders on a promised bailout, drink the Koolaide and then figure out the next day that it has no poison to cure their ills.

Computerized trading will continue to profit off this predictable manic mood swing, so don't expect it to be fixed anytime soon.

I can break this down for everyone. The stock market has been ignoring the US since 2008. All the money is being bet on Europe. That's why things are crummy here and the stock market keeps going up. The problem is that OUR banking system tanked their economies too. Now, as per the admission of one Wall Street trader, people are betting on the survival or failure of the European system. Ours has already failed, so the markets (and jobs) went elsewhere. Therefore, ever time there is a bump in Europe, the stock market drops. Every time they look like they may be closer to a solution, it goes up. Simple.

Eurozone leaders agreed last week that private holders of Greek bonds should take a 50 percent loss on their holdings.

I wonder if Goldman Sachs is going to "take a 50 percent loss on their [Greek] holdings.

Wait a minute:

The global economic crisis sheds light on the connection between Greece and Goldman Sachs.

http://www.globalization101.org/news1/Goldman_Sachs_Greece

Yep, Goldman Sachs is right in the middle of this "Greek", "EU", and "IMF" crisis:

What Does This Have to Do with Goldman Sachs’s Fraud?

Goldman Sachs is another example of how hedge funds’ risky speculations can help magnify financial meltdowns. Hedge funds contributed extensively to the subprime mortgage crisis and still continue to bet against Greece, causing Greek government bonds to depreciate, thus increasing Greek debt.⁹ Greece’s debt problem may potentially lead to the breakup of the Eurozone and a collapse of the international financial economy.

Same link as above.

Expect Goldman to try and DUMP their Greek interests.........China, watch out !!!!!

The European banks stress test was an optimistic display of confidence.They are not going to stand anything close to 2008. Google for "european bank kondratieff wave" to understand the wishful thinking.

Last week we learned they had "solved" the crisis by agreeing to lend Greece more money and stocks immediately shot up. Now this week there are new worries and stocks go down. This is a pendulum with a VERY short shaft that is swinging very rapidly.

The problem is that none of these "fixes" are actually solving the problem, which is too much spending on social programs and pensions. And at the same time we see Europe crumbling under her debt load, we see protesters here in the United States demanding the same things that caused Europe's downfall. The protesters here want free college, high wages "regardless of employment status", guaranteed pensions, blah blah blah. The liberal left has made a grand mess of the world by promising something for nothing in exchange for votes and support, and it has left the world's resources drained.

The Democrats should be all over this but they won't. Obama has nothing to do with Europe, yet every time Wall Street "Dives" he gets blamed.

He is only the POTUS not of Europe. Yet Americans allow the TGOP to continue to blame the Dems and The Prez. how foolish.

Most of the "Dives" on Wall Street have been because of the instability of Europe and Greece specifically.

All any one has to do is Google back and see for themselves, yet Americans don't because they are indoctrinated not to THINK FOR THEMSELVES!

Have to totally agree with you DMAC-1004611! One day, hurray we are moving up, the next day oh dear going down. The reporting on this issue is sick and does not leave a good taste in my mouth for what we are being fed by those "journalists" that are obviously catering to Obama and his clowns.

Ah, and another thing that is not made clear by the press, this is NOT the Republicans and Bush's fault!!! Might want to bring that point out because those Democrats in this country don't get that!

Good for the people of Greece. The banks took risks, they were bad risks....so they lose. Too bad. If they go down, someone else with more fiscal responsibility will rise up.

This idea of lending and lending and lending more to spend what governments don't have is ridiculous.

Let the people of Greece bankrupt out of their debt and start fresh. Goldman Sach's loses a ton. Big deal.

They feel like they have to blame or credit SOMETHING, so today it is Greece. The reality is that the brokerage firms make a ton on volatility and THEY advise the jittery investors... so guess what... SELL!!!! No. BUY!!!!!!!, SELLLL!!!! BUY!!!

Just making the rich richer, the poor poorer, and the middle... well... we're just screwed.

What I would like to know is how the average citizen from this 27 nation bloc, called the European Union, is feeling now. I also would like to know why some of the member countries did not convert their currency over to the "Euro." Germany seems to be doing just fine. Did they ever thank us for all that we did to feed and rebuild their country after WWII?

Is this the same "bill-of-goods" that President Bush The Elder told the nation in his speech on the "New World Order?"

In reading and remembering the formation of the EU in the 90s I do recall that many countries held out for a long time before finally voting to join. They were primarily sold on the "economic advantages," and the power of numbers. A little reporting of "The Man On The Street" would be telling. A comedic take off like the late genius Steve Allen once did might be funny as heck.

We The People may want to watch carefully so that this does not happen to us. We are experiencing more than enough problems without taking on those of other nations. We are supporting, in the majority, 80% of NATO. Untold sums for a United Nations. Millions and Billions here, there and most everywhere to counties that most Americans could not find on a world map.

LMarcT Post 1.12 is so correct in the last five words of that Vine tendril post. We have seen the demise of the great American middle-class. Every day looks more bleak for the once back-bone of our nation. I wish the fools on the hill would simply define what they mean by "small business." In most towns across our vast country one would think that by definition that would be the electrician, plumber, lawn service, heating and air, and such who has two trucks on the road and employs 4 or 5 people.

Will this impact, in a positive way, the exchange rate for our $dollar to the euro? That would be nice in trade and for tourists. Show caution children as you are already paying for more than you may know.

shocking Ido..i mean goldman sachs doing anything wrong..cmon

As usual a completely ridiculous unintelible report by msnbc. What the hell is a VIX Index and what does that have to do with Greece? When Europe stated many years ago that it was going to form a union, I got a sick feeling in my stomach. How could so many different countries with so many different nationalistic fevers ever join together and agree on so many different ideas.

And today we see the first major problem! There will be many more. The Euro is in deep crap. It was better to leave all the countries with their separate economies and make a free trade zone and issuing a second European passport for the citizens for free travel.

It is similar to a successful marriage, you marry the person and try to live together but don't marry them thinking you are going to change them.

Here we have 27 completely different countries and political systems and social/economic systems trying to make one marriage. Completely ridiculous and the worse part is that even they don't know what they are doing or how to govern themselves within the system.

Greece has been in the European Union for over 20 years and the system wasn't monitoring Greece and Greece let themselves get completely outside the norms that they are bankrupt.

Remember a bridge is only as strong as its weakest rivet.

LMARCT If you are not intelligent enough to know and understand the stock and bond market on your own don't get into it. You can gt 10% dividends on U.S. stocks and be taxed at 15%. There is a list, spread your money over the companies that have been issuing dividends for the last 20 years.

Any advice you get from a stock broker, newspaper or journal is old and ridiculous. If what is said or written is so good, why don't the people touting the stock bond buy it? Because they already did and want the price to rise to short it and let you take the loss. It will take you a good 6months to a year to understand a small part of world and U.S. finances and you will make money.

So don't blame the brokerage companies or follow their advise. You are human have a brain and use it. Don't follow the herd, knock out a small niche and take care of it.

My uncle was a tile setter. His wife my aunt for 50 years always bought cheap stalwart companies putting aside so much every week. She is 99 and they never had any money troubles. A very rich woman.

Joe-755363 You don't have the vaguest idea of what you are blathering about! Greece lived beyond its means and borrowed until it violated all the rules and regulations of the European Union. The Greeks wanted/want a soft life and they want the people of the other countries to pay for it. There you have it pure and simple. Socialism doesn't work especially when the people don't want to work and want other people to pay for their laid back system.

Joe you spend all your money and go to the bank and the bank is not going to loan you money. You default on bank loans and you lose everything. You don't want to work and want your neighbors to pay for your laziness? GOOD LUCK!

Wilberta Berry it was Clinton who encouraged wall street and banks to issue subprime loans to credit unworthy individuals:

http://www.globalization101.org/news1/Goldman_Sachs_Greece

Subprime mortgages are mortgages lent to people, who are likely to default. In 1993, prime interest rates were low, and real interest rates were negative. The more one bought; the more one got back. People flocked to get loans to receive this benefit. President Clinton also eased credit regulation on mortgages to help economically disadvantaged people buy houses. With subprime mortgages, interest rates increase over time to insure against defaults.

A Messenger-2926105 read the article on: http://www.globalization101.org/news1/Goldman_Sachs_Greece

It was Greece that got greedy and its tail in a crack. The door was slammed on it and now its howling!

The Greek spent their Euros and didn't stop along the way to gauge the political and economic situation. As usual the politicians got greedy and corrupt and were paid off to turn their heads until the situation is tinder dry and ready to go up in flames.

Let me ask you a question. If you had a collection 500 of $1000of baseballs signed by Joe Dimaggio and each one is worth $1000. and you find out his ex manager is going to put 1000 balls for sale at $500 are you going to sell your collection of Joe DiMaggion signed baseballs at the current market price of $1000 or are you going to wait for the price to fall to $500? Know you got $500,000 in baseballs and you found out that this sale of 1000 balls is going to happen in several months. Are you going to hang onto those balls and lose $250,000 or take your $500,000 today and in several months buy the $500 balls and still have the collection of 500 signed Joe Dimaggio balls and $250,000 in the bank?

This is what Goldman Sachs did with the Greek bonds. Unfortunately for Goldman Sachs there are laws for doing this type of operation and they played both sides of the fence AT THE SAME TIME! So now the problem is still Greek and Goldman Sachs played the devil by selling and then buying the same bonds and doing it for their customers. It is complicated but it will take time to figure out. But the baseball example is clear.

Cavalier go back to school and study economics. The Greeks tanked their own economy with corrupt politicians and bureaucrats who took the top off their investments in the Balkans. READ. If the Greeks were honest and kept their fingers out of the pie and on the pulse of their investments, they wouldn't be in this mess.

And honest man if you see a sale and you need the items are you not going to load up? The Greeks burned their fingers and mostly Western European investors pulled their investments out of Greece and the Balkans where Greece invested their money devalued their money and can't pay back Greece and the bonds that Greece issued are now worthless.

So don't blame it on savy Americans who figured out how to make money on a foolish corrupt country that can't and wouldn't control its finances. HINT U.S. POLITICIANS YOU ARE FOLLOWING THE GREEK EXAMPLE!

And for reference Greece is 3 times as corrupt as the U.S. and 4 times as corrupt as Denmark. Now how can Denmark and Greece both be in the European Union with such different social/economic values?

Maryland,

"Once Europe shutters, then the whole deck of cards will come tumbling down and we will have another global recession"

I think it will be little more than a global recession, something like a global depression which we are in but don't know it yet.

Tontosh,

I hope you are wrong but it could very well be a depression given the breadth of the system. This is what you get when you intertwine your economy and export jobs to the low cost leader. I am preparing as much as I can. I don't have "bunker mentality" but I am making plans. We have very low debt and the means to support ourselves if it all comes crashing down. I pray to God there is a miracle of some sort.

This thing has been building for an awful long time. Worldwide depression is probably the only correction that will actually "work" (if you want to use that terminology). We have been spending and spending with no restraint for 75 years. Sooner or later someone has to pay the bill. That bill is coming due.

Honestly ... I expected all this to crash sooner than this. I'm amazed that they've been able to keep things afloat this long. The coming crash will be interesting to watch.

Maryland,

The only miracle will be if the Democrats and Republicans come together and do the right thing and forget politics. This is NOT that difficult to fix, yes, there will be pain for all of us but it will make us stronger and there is no other way. Some of us have great ideas in creating millions of jobs without increasing the debt but we have no voice. Like I said if both parties give up and work together than we have a chance otherwise it is Depression all the way. I wish I am wrong but after running my own business ALL my life, what government/Fed is doing is criminal.

Maryland republican

Europe represents about 45% of our exports

Maryland,

Most of your post is correct. However, Europe represents about 20% of our exports. Either way I agree. When the EU gets hit the effect on the US will be immense.

Max,

100% correct.

This has been coming for some time. Reaganomics started the oscillations with deregulation, and since every major economy follows our lead, they've been on the same roller-coaster. Imports and exports are not really the issue here, it's where the money is invested. With the US economy in a flat recovery, investment has gone to Europe, and if it tanks, a lot of really big businesses that are too big to fail are going to fail anyway, because there is no more money in the US to bail them out. Europe, unlike the US which is a single country, is a loosely associated group of countries which are economically connected to a single currency. What that actually means is that they can't be forced to help each other by any law, the EU can just "suggest" that they do the "right thing." Well, they probably will make a half hearted attempt, because each country thinks they are strong in their own right, and what ever happens to other EU countries will open markets for them. They are wrong. Once one fails, the Euro will dive with it, and there will be a cascade of failures. The UK was smart to stay out of the EU. They may end up being the most robust economy standing on that side of the Atlantic. I'm not counting China, of course, who will be our economic overlords eventually, no matter what we do, thanks to free trade and the WTO.

Most people have cut back on what they are buying, but since most products are outside of this country, it seems to me the ones who will get really hurt are the Chinese.

Sooooooooo

Tontosh,

Toss Grandma into the street is the solution eh? let the disabled suffer eh? Yep gotta protect those trillionares and billionares profits eh? Gotta make sure they are too big to fail eh?

In my opinion this is just more fear mongroling from the Republican'ts... The best way to save the economy is end the department of homeland defense, end the fed, and reduce the military budget to only 50 billion a year and not one penny more unless we declare war on an ACTUAL nation, not some crime syndicate.

I’m just one of millions of Americans watching my IRA being manipulated again by Wall Street greed. These phony headlines about Greece’s debt and other trumped up BS are not fooling anyone that has been paying attention to this latest theft. The crooks in charge of this rip off would pay a writer to say a "A monkey farted in Kenya causing the market to fall today", I have seen all kinds of excuses and fake stories about why the market is on this roller coaster ride but the real reason is simply the greed of few once more stealing from the many.

Magnum Serpentine - so, you only want a 'select' segment of the population to sacrifice? The terrible 'rich' who already pay the lions share of the tax burden in this country?

Then to the scare tactics, throw grandma into the streets (even though any talk of fixing SS was for those UNDER 50 YEARS OLD, and there has not been (to my knowledge) any talk of cutting of people who are disabled, perhaps going after those getting paid fraudulently). But keep going with the scare tactics, it is what BOTH sides do best.

Sorry, EVERYONE will have to make SOME sacrifice, if you don't YET see that 15 Trillion in US debt, growing at 1 Trillion every 14 months with only 47% of the population actually paying Federal Income tax is not a problem that requires everyone to sacrifice in some manner, you are insane. You could tax the richest 1% ALL of their income and it would NOT put a dent into the US debt. Do you even understand these numbers? The answer has to be NO based on your post.

You could double the taxes on those of us who pay Federal Income taxes (53%) of the country and it STILL WON'T fix the debt problem. There is waste all all levels but if you don't see that changes NEED to happen with SS and medicaid, then you are delusional. Call it an entitlement or whatever you want, the Government is on the verge of collaps financially and you are too blind to see it.

Enjoy getting NOTHING when it does collapse because 'whoever' didn't want to make a sacrifice because everyone has some 'sob story' as to why they cannot afford to sacrifice. You seem to think you magically keep printing money, you have no concept the effect of this and the devaluing of our money and the inevitable RISE of inflation. Keep blaming the 'rich' that will solve everything...good luck when it all crumbles, you can continue to blame the rich I'm sure it will make you feel better.

I thought the republicants did want govt involvement..ie regulations????

The US is probably one of the few countries on the planet that has a chance to weather the upcoming collapse of the world economy.

We have (and need to start immediately drilling for) more than enough oil and gas to power our country for over 100 years! We have the most arable land and if we quit burning our food supply we can easily feed our entire population with NO imports. We have almost every natural resource on the planet to use for manufacturing and what we don't have other nations will be more than happy to sell it to us at OUR price.

We need to get our A$$ES out of the rest of the world unless they are paying us to be there, at a profit to us. Get our military on our own soil and prepare to "repel boarders" because there will be plenty of people trying to get here, even by force if necessary.

We may have to suffer losing some imports but as a nation we are capable of rebuilding our manufacturing infrastructure in a relatively short time. We have the know-how and capability.

Large banks and investment companies are going to evaporate. Investors who are heavily into other countries are going to be skinned alive.

If we went back to the "gold standard" at today's gold prices (locked in) we would be the richest country on the planet, by hundreds of times. Our debts to China, Japan and others would seem like chump change! Just write them a check and be done with it...

Let the Middle East, Mexico and others eat their oil because we don't need it. Although many cry about our country, we are still the leaders of the WORLD. Being self sufficient will keep us there. Having more than enough food supply, we will dictate the direction the world will go.

Bring our military home, seal our borders and let's grow America again...

No, they don't need a kick in the ass, they need to withdraw from the Euro and enter bankruptcy, and then get their house in order. Iceland did very well, thank you.

I know what you mean Tax!!! Hahahahahah. But you would be surprised how many MTV'd and ESPN Drones are in America and just how little they know what that word "TRUELY" means. LOL

It was going on prior to the EU, just then when a country like Greece's economy went sour, it didn't effect the whole region.

The Dems or Repubs have NOTHING to do with what is happening in the EU. I wish people like you would STFU with your delusional rants!!!

Greenland is part of Denmark.

Greenland left the European Economic Community, not the European Union.

IMHO, Greenland was granted self determination in 2009. While they are still a part of the Kingdon of Denmark, they are in essence a separate country.

I agree 100%. Well said. This country needs to stand on its own.

And who, pray tell, would lead this new system? Someone of YOUR choosing most likely. That's why delusional babblings by people like you hold no value. We spent ourselves into oblivian. I am sure if I came to your house I would find more that 50% of all your belongings manufactured in a NON-American company. You are contributing to the demise of America while, at the same time, prostelitizing about how you have the "solution" for our problem. I have one to. STFU!!!

you maybe right,but it was hard to look at my lose in the last three months.i`m just a very tiny player and i lost 3 thousand.

To ARIFELIFE You are a total ass and are not a very wise individual,RETURN TO YOU PROGRAMING @ FOX or CNN propaganda specialist FOR MORE BRAIN WASHING. CAPITALISM IS THE PROBLEM IT DID THIS ALL BY IT GREEDY CORRUPT SELF.

Capitalism is not the problem it is the solution. The problem is governemts trying to make housing and health care 'affordable' for everyone with the help of the people in those sectors, cronyism.

alan_static

Capitalism is not the problem it is the solution. The problem is governemts trying to make housing and health care 'affordable' for everyone with the help of the people in those sectors, cronyism.

Very well stated Alan. Every one should read the book. You know the book!!! If they read it back in the 50s, they should read it again. Everything is happening almost word for word except on a larger scale.

Unrestrained capitalism is the Problem.

And a---rand, no one wants to read your stupid book.

Unfortunately we live in a Global Economy, if Greece fails, the EU might fail, our Economy will then fail.

the most intelligent post on the vine!

Never will, since they have a totally rigged game for themselves and they just take ours[ investors ] and the worlds money, a suckers game do not play it with them. They want to enslave the whole dam world using our tax money as well to accomplish it. The 99% will take back our country.

Sure Chuck....

Let's run right back into the(burning house of) failed financial policies that got us into this mess in the 1st place. Where do you think the $$ is going..???. come man think for a change.!

Oh for crying out aloud! Enough with the anti-Obama tirades from the Republican camp. It was a Republican President (Nixon) that messed up the world by taking the US off the dollar. It was a Republican President (Reagan) that screwed up our tax system by giving the rich breaks whilst doubling Social Security taxes which he then raided to pay for the rich peoples tax break. And it was a the most hopelessly inept president of all time (Bush Jr) that took us into two pointless wars and ignored the brewing home mortgage debt catastrophe. If any group of people need to hang their heads low it is the Republicans. Their track record for destroying our economy speaks for itself.

Bull S--- spoken by an idiot.

I wish you wingnuts would stop it with the "We are heading the way of Europe" B.S. Greece, Portugal, Spain, Italy and Ireland are NOT Europe, they are merely countries in Europe. Oh, and I do love how you wingnuts leave Ireland off of your list when bashing countries in Europe on how bad their economy is, because their problems is caused by having taxes too low.

Our economic problems are not about what we are doing today. It is about what we have already done. Economy is not a machine that you can oil and grease and fine tune to run at a certain pace. Due to earlier optimism, entire population has already borrowed all they can for decades. Money supply was inflated with borrowed money. Prices and salaries were inflated with borrowed money. What we borrowed is our money supply. It needs to be paid back with interest. It will deflate when borrowing stops because the money to pay old debt with interest does not exist. Interest demand for money that is created out of nothing is the cause of chronic money shortage in the economy. Crash is coming.

www.tradingstocks.net/html/prepare_for_market_crash.html

Why are you ranting and raving about what our government wants to do int eh future. We already crashed in the Past (2006- now, if you haven't been paying attention), with Reaganomics in full effect!!! Even the Bush Tax cuts are still in place. Why did this NOT keep us out of recession????